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Mousetown, my own 73 CL350

LongDistanceRider said:
There's a valley where the washer meets the outer tube, fill it with RTV so water can't collect there. I probably went overboard doing it but I used enough that there's a slope from the edge of the washer up the sides.
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It still baffles me how that much water could get in there. Let alone the dirt. I still think a rear facing weep hole would have been beneficial.
 
My theory would be that water can get by the grooves in the top cushion of the fork ear
Fork ear top.jpg


Any water that does get in is trapped by the lower fork ear cushion
Fork ear bottom.jpg
 
boddy said:
My theory would be that water can get by the grooves in the top cushion of the fork ear



Any water that does get in is trapped by the lower fork ear cushion
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That is too logical. I'll bet on an inadvertent micro climate dew collection device design aspect.
 
RockReef said:
That’s good stuff. Made by Boeing. Popular in the mt bike world, but it’s expensive.
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It is pricey but I bought a can probably ten years ago and I've used it on four different bikes I've rebuilt and I still have half a can left.
A little goes a long ways.
 
It was easier to take this starter apart than I thought. These 350 starters are simpler than the 150 or 305.
Spray paint lids fit just right and saved me some masking.

cqDOttl.jpg




There wasn't hardly any grease in there. Also found a broken thin shim of the wrong size.
Scotchbrite pads work great on the commutators.
I'm just going to seal it up with a little bit of GasketCinch.

IqN8rRk.jpg




Curing other painted parts on my heater.


EgwSo2d.jpg
 
Does anyone know the correct amount of fork oil to be used in these K5 forks? I assume 10 W fork oil?

edit: Owner's manual says periodic drain and fill but no other info.
 
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I believe the shop manual calls for "Honda ATF". The K4 Owners Manual I have just says "ATF".
Personally I use 15w Bel-Ray fork oil.
This is from the 1974 shop manual.
CBCL350_fork_oil-capacity.jpg
 
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Paint came out great on the starter and side covers. The Rustoleum isn't around these parts in an engine enamel, just more normal paints and they are part of the Sherwin Williams company. Which also owns Dupli Color and the VHT brand I believe. This stuff has gone from $12.99 a can just before Covid to around $20-24 now at the usual retailer's.

How is the price for your paints down the US way?
 
Flyin900 said:
Paint came out great on the starter and side covers. The Rustoleum isn't around these parts in an engine enamel, just more normal paints and they are part of the Sherwin Williams company. Which also owns Dupli Color and the VHT brand I believe. This stuff has gone from $12.99 a can just before Covid to around $20-24 now at the usual retailer's.

How is the price for your paints down the US way?
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Last time I bought a couple of cans of VHT couple of months ago they were ~$16-17? a can I think, I was surprised.
 
Flyin900 said:
Paint came out great on the starter and side covers. The Rustoleum isn't around these parts in an engine enamel, just more normal paints and they are part of the Sherwin Williams company. Which also owns Dupli Color and the VHT brand I believe. This stuff has gone from $12.99 a can just before Covid to around $20-24 now at the usual retailer's.

How is the price for your paints down the US way?
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Thanks, I always go too fast and too much and end up with runs. I think this is my best so far. :D No primer, just sanded with fine foam blocks.
This was a bout the cheapest. Hopefully durable but not high heat particularly. It does not say to bake it but requires some time to reach max durability.

 
ballbearian said:
Thanks, I always go too fast and too much and end up with runs. I think this is my best so far. :D No primer, just sanded with fine foam blocks.
This was a bout the cheapest. Hopefully durable but not high heat particularly. It does not say to bake it but requires some time to reach max durability.

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I switched to Amazon Canada and it shows not available, yet it did quote a price of about $12.00 Canadian which is a deal if/when they get it back in stock. Strange they don't recommend curing it with heat. The VHT and Dupli Color products do recommend 200-250F and about 1 hr of cure time to set the paints ability to resist chemicals and oils etc.
The 500F is the same rating as the Dupli Color engine enamel and that's lots for an air-cooled bike motor. If your above that temp you will have more things to worry about than paint peeling! ;)
 
The OEM oil pump gaskets are .4mm and don't come in the aftermarket gasket sets. I'm sitting here cutting out some in .66mm. Is that going to be a problem? I can't imagine the pump arm or piston would care about such a tiny amount of deflection.
 
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Besides the gasket question, I'm not sure how these come apart. The circlip is removed but the inner rod won't slide right out. I didn't loosen the bottom allen as I've heard it can be a pain. K5 here.

9L4deTN.jpg
 
Tom,if you screw the spring assembly/top cap back down,it may help you to gain purchase/hold the inner damper rod;put the upper fork tube in a vise with soft jaws,then pull the bottom 'lower' toward you while securely holding the lower to keep it from turning and hit it with the impact.
I like using an electric impact wrench which zips them loose 99% of the time: one quick snap just to loosen it.
 
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Seconded on the electric impact driver, whips those bolts out a treat.

I did the fork seals on my Hornet recently and the problem I had ( apart from brain fade, fitting seals wrong way up :sleep: ) was doing the bottom allen screw back up again. Just refitting the fork springs etc didn't hold things tight enough to stop the piece that the allen screw threads into from rotating.

So I used this special tool. Springs etc all removed, shoved this down the tube, leaned on it while tightening the screw. Rubber ferule gripped the rotating part brilliantly.

GDCR0BJ.jpg
 
Richard Pitman said:
So I used this special tool. Springs etc all removed, shoved this down the tube, leaned on it while tightening the screw. Rubber ferule gripped the rotating part brilliantly.
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Hmmm, I don't see a Honda part number on that special tool, wonder if it's still available...
 
Richard Pitman said:
Seconded on the electric impact driver, whips those bolts out a treat.

I did the fork seals on my Hornet recently and the problem I had ( apart from brain fade, fitting seals wrong way up :sleep: ) was doing the bottom allen screw back up again. Just refitting the fork springs etc didn't hold things tight enough to stop the piece that the allen screw threads into from rotating.

So I used this special tool. Springs etc all removed, shoved this down the tube, leaned on it while tightening the screw. Rubber ferule gripped the rotating part brilliantly.

GDCR0BJ.jpg
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Special damper rod holder tool ! Lol ! If it works ;)
 
Richard Pitman said:
Seconded on the electric impact driver, whips those bolts out a treat.

I did the fork seals on my Hornet recently and the problem I had ( apart from brain fade, fitting seals wrong way up :sleep: ) was doing the bottom allen screw back up again. Just refitting the fork springs etc didn't hold things tight enough to stop the piece that the allen screw threads into from rotating.

So I used this special tool. Springs etc all removed, shoved this down the tube, leaned on it while tightening the screw. Rubber ferule gripped the rotating part brilliantly.
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Ha! That's brilliant. Unfortunately, or fortunately, I don't have one those special tools yet.
I think I used a broom stick on the forks on my CB750 and the CJ too I believe.
+1 on the impact driver, spins them right out.
 
I remember about using the special tool. That's why I asked first instead of forging ahead.

I do have a stout oak special tool with the added feature of the curved handle, instead of the 'T' which has been used to successfully pop out a top dent in a gas tank before. :D
 
My trick has been to compress the assembled fork tube once off the bike with the fork upside down using the floor. This puts tension on the lower assembly from the internal fork spring, then hit the sunken lower allen bolt with an impact gun and bit. Make sure the allen headed bit is fully inserted into the bolt, as I have stripped a few hex heads by not getting all the gunk out of the head first.
Then I had to resort to drilling the head off. :mad:
 
I got it with just a key and a cheater. I should get a set of allen drivers to have around.
My goal was to just clean and rinse these forks, as they did seem fine and had no leaks, just old oil with a little contamination. I'll just rinse out the lowers and skip further disassembly of the inner tube and spring. Not even a half teaspoon of sludge in the bottom.

LnkC3v6.jpg




I was surprised to see the oil pump factory gasket come off with the pump intact. I suppose I could just bolt it right back on as is. No one has commented on using a thicker gasket as a replacement. Either way, I'm saving my one and only OEM gasket until I'm comfortable with my hand cut thick ones or I find some that aren't ridiculous in price. What is it with these gasket sets being so darn stingy with oil pump gaskets? My 305 Dream was the same way.

rif12ak.jpg
 
ballbearian said:
I got it with just a key and a cheater. I should get a set of allen drivers to have around.
My goal was to just clean and rinse these forks, as they did seem fine and had no leaks, just old oil with a little contamination. I'll just rinse out the lowers and skip further disassembly of the inner tube and spring. Not even a half teaspoon of sludge in the bottom.

LnkC3v6.jpg




I was surprised to see the oil pump factory gasket come off with the pump intact. I suppose I could just bolt it right back on as is. No one has commented on using a thicker gasket as a replacement. Either way, I'm saving my one and only OEM gasket until I'm comfortable with my hand cut thick ones or I find some that aren't ridiculous in price. What is it with these gasket sets being so darn stingy with oil pump gaskets? My 305 Dream was the same way.

rif12ak.jpg
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Nice gasket (y)
 
The factory oil pump gaskets as you know are usually a thin brown material. I have seen the same type of material in some aftermarket ones and other times thicker gasket material. The OEM kit I just ordered for the CL175 has what appears to be a black thicker one. I have yet to receive it from the seller and just going by the picture.
 
Flyin900 said:
The factory oil pump gaskets as you know are usually a thin brown material. .
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I have noticed this before as well. And I have read about the old school way of using an old cereal box to make a quick side cover gasket. There is a thin brown material they slip over the bottle at the local corner store that could possibly be used in a similar fashion as the cereal box. I have considered this option myself, yet cannot completely endorse since I haven’t actually done it. Perhaps it could be a consideration to help scratch the “packratitis” itch of a resourceful individual like ballbearian?
 
Richard Pitman said:
Seconded on the electric impact driver, whips those bolts out a treat.

I did the fork seals on my Hornet recently and the problem I had ( apart from brain fade, fitting seals wrong way up :sleep: ) was doing the bottom allen screw back up again. Just refitting the fork springs etc didn't hold things tight enough to stop the piece that the allen screw threads into from rotating.

So I used this special tool. Springs etc all removed, shoved this down the tube, leaned on it while tightening the screw. Rubber ferule gripped the rotating part brilliantly.
Click to expand...

Richard, I guess you didn't check the bolt screwed all the way into damper rod before assembly. In all probability, there was still thread lock or sealer in damper rod threads
 
crazypj said:
Richard, I guess you didn't check the bolt screwed all the way into damper rod before assembly. In all probability, there was still thread lock or sealer in damper rod threads
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Yeah, there was remnants of some wimpy sealer, like GasketCinch, but nothing that looked like a threadlock. Same stuff found on the cam cover, cam box, side covers, etc. Pretty sure this was factory.
 
It's just too cold out to use my buffer, which has been living under a wheelbarrow on the patio, so I drug it in the shop attached to two 50lb. cinder blocks and sits on an old truck mudflap to keep the vibrations from sliding around. I removed the clear coat on the fork lowers with emery cloth strips and then buffed it to an acceptable polish. Not as nice as ancientdads 450 legs, but passable.

2k2BLhk.jpg



Also got the rear fender back together with the repainted tailight and a once over on the chrome with the Turtlewax polish after it got a soak in the Bilthamber Deox-C 5 gallon bucket. It was pretty bad but straight. Again passable. The factory wheel/tire info sticker was long gone and it needed the VHT touch. I need to get some more stickers for the herd.

otjfGda.jpg



In order to get the forks reassembled, I needed a better circlip pliers, so I finished filing the tips of a pair of needlenose that had been repurposed many years ago for FIATs that are now my official fork clip tool.
Also getting a temporary wheel ready for use and used my vintage VAR no.13 pin spanner (bicycle tool) on the bearing lock collar.

FvMLUPr.jpg



Here is a question on the forks. There is a hole in the fork tube about 4 inches from the bottom that allows the fluid to move. The tubes are not marked for where this hole is on the tops (but I could mark it) and then orient this hole forward or behind , etc. for optimal fork oil flow but does it make any difference?
 
ballbearian said:
It's just too cold out to use my buffer, which has been living under a wheelbarrow on the patio, so I drug it in the shop attached to two 50lb. cinder blocks and sits on an old truck mudflap to keep the vibrations from sliding around. I removed the clear coat on the fork lowers with emery cloth strips and then buffed it to an acceptable polish. Not as nice as ancientdads 450 legs, but passable.

2k2BLhk.jpg



Also got the rear fender back together with the repainted tailight and a once over on the chrome with the Turtlewax polish after it got a soak in the Bilthamber Deox-C 5 gallon bucket. It was pretty bad but straight. Again passable. The factory wheel/tire info sticker was long gone and it needed the VHT touch. I need to get some more stickers for the herd.

otjfGda.jpg



In order to get the forks reassembled, I needed a better circlip pliers, so I finished filing the tips of a pair of needlenose that had been repurposed many years ago for FIATs that are now my official fork clip tool.
Also getting a temporary wheel ready for use and used my vintage VAR no.13 pin spanner (bicycle tool) on the bearing lock collar.

FvMLUPr.jpg



Here is a question on the forks. There is a hole in the fork tube about 4 inches from the bottom that allows the fluid to move. The tubes are not marked for where this hole is on the tops (but I could mark it) and then orient this hole forward or behind , etc. for optimal fork oil flow but does it make any difference?
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I honestly don't think it matters which way the hole is oriented on the fork tube;I would do it forward,imo.
The small hole is there to lube the movement of the fork tube inside the lower/slider.
I see you(and many others)have a shop W/ tools including a motor driven buffing wheel and I want one;I've been stuck working outside in a parking space for 6+ years on my bike which gets more challenging in the cold.

You're making that bike very nice and I'm sure the mice will appreciate a dressed-up home after you finish it.
 
bilbikek411 said:
I honestly don't think it matters which way the hole is oriented on the fork tube;I would do it forward,imo.
The small hole is there to lube the movement of the fork tube inside the lower/slider.
I see you(and many others)have a shop W/ tools including a motor driven buffing wheel and I want one;I've been stuck working outside in a parking space for 6+ years on my bike which gets more challenging in the cold.

You're making that bike very nice and I'm sure the mice will appreciate a dressed-up home after you finish it.
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Rodent trespassing is punishable by death. 100% effective for repeat offenders.
 
ballbearian said:
Rodent trespassing is punishable by death. 100% effective for repeat offenders.
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Speaking of that, a couple of months ago I went out to the shop late one night. I flipped on the lights and spotted a mouse crossing the room! It's been about ten years since I had any mice out there.
To shorten the story I refreshed my "Tomcat" bait traps and now there are now not just one but two less mice in the shop.
Shortly thereafter I spotted another mouse in my garage. For that one I set out a spring trap baited with the classic, cheese, and about two hours later that mouse was deceased as well.
 
ballbearian said:
Not as nice as ancientdads 450 legs, but passable.
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I am not to be considered as the standard, and TBH your lower legs (well, actually the bike's because nobody wants to see either of our lower legs) look damn good and plenty shiny. In fact, probably more accurate compared to original finish.

ballbearian said:
and it needed the VHT touch
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I like to put my specialty stickers on the lower portion of the fender below the tag. Since my father painted the factory satin black CBX sidecovers the color of the bike on my first one, I put a factory CBX sidecover sticker on the lower part of the rear fender on both of my CBXs and on my 450 I had a sticker guy in St. Pete make my TT Racer stickers. Sadly, apparently few remember the bike magazine reference to that phrase in the late '60s and early '70s (tavern to tavern)
ballbearian said:
so I finished filing the tips of a pair of needlenose that had been repurposed many years ago
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There are many pairs of needlenose pliers in my garage and toolboxes that my father ground and filed for that very reason, including many circlip pliers tips that he also reshaped during his outboard motor refurbish efforts. Unfortunately it often makes then useless for any standard purpose thereafter, so I have a pile of 'specialty' tools now.
 
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ballbearian said:
Here is a question on the forks. There is a hole in the fork tube about 4 inches from the bottom that allows the fluid to move. The tubes are not marked for where this hole is on the tops (but I could mark it) and then orient this hole forward or behind , etc. for optimal fork oil flow but does it make any difference?
Click to expand...
It doesn't really matter as oil should always be above level of the hole.
If you really want to orientate it though, have it towards back of slider because angle of forks will make sure it's 'further down' into oil.
Honda doesn't give a spec but I tend to do oil level from top of tube, springs out fork compressed.
Start at 5.5" then remove oil half inch at a time to where it feels best.
On some bikes (older Triumph's and many MX) you will often end up around 7".
Before I had a fork oil height gauge, I used a syringe and small diameter tube (pretty much what the oil gauge is except it's stainless tube marked in inches and mm)
The higher the oil level, the less air is in forks so it acts as a rising rate spring (something very few people ever think about or even realise)
 
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