Maintenance and modifications, now 7 years on

Seems they always stick to the gauge but IIRC, they are supposed to have a lip on the bucket that holds the rubber and the gauge is supposed to slide in. I would work slow with a butter knife and tiny squirts of WD40 around the chrome underside then same around the sides of the gauge till it's loose. There is a similar one on my CB160 that had a couple gouges that I sculpted/patched with black LiquidTape, as it's softer than Shoegoo. Black silicone caulk (exterior) would be good, I've had a lot of caulking experience and learned the 'wet finger' technique of smoothing and sculpting that stuff. Unless Klause(Clause?)Studios has a repop or DSS has something, you'll have to get creative with some kind of weather stripping I guess.
 
ancientdad said:
Hopefully I can get it swapped over without damage. I'll change the neutral light jewel to the blue one while I'm in there, and change the headlight rim to the actual CB77 rim too.
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What color is the neutral jewel in this gauge? Green?

I decided to replace the rubber mounts behind the gauges on my 360 while I'm sorting out the light flicker and had forgotten that I substituted electrical tape there when reanimating the bike in 2014. It actually made for a semi decent replacement, so you could maybe add a wrap of electrical tape to the outside if the band is damaged during transfer.
 
stl360+450 said:
What color is the neutral jewel in this gauge? Green?
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There is no neutral light in the gauge, only a red high beam indicator in the top center and illumination bulbs on the sides. Since they used red for high beam back then it's my guess that blue was the neutral light color, much like the neutral light wire then apparently was black with white stripe which is what the bulb and socket inside this complete headlight assembly, cut away from the bike at the main harness at some point, had inside it. Along with a factory rubber 90° connector to the plastic nut on the jewel, which I know is original because Stanley is molded into it.
stl360+450 said:
I decided to replace the rubber mounts behind the gauges on my 360 while I'm sorting out the light flicker and had forgotten that I substituted electrical tape there when reanimating the bike in 2014. It actually made for a semi decent replacement, so you could maybe add a wrap of electrical tape to the outside if the band is damaged during transfer.
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I have some of that roll of self-fusing silicone tape from Vintage Connections and I had a thought to give it a top cover wrap with that, sticking it together on the backside where most won't notice it.
 
Not knowing much about a CB77, I did not realize the ring around the top of the gauge where the rubber cushion sits (also where the screw holes are for holding the gauge in the headlight case) was not actually part of the gauge. It slides off and the rubber ring goes with it. Well, not easily when it apparently hadn't been removed from the other gauge maybe ever. The rubber was stuck to the bottom of the crimp ring and I literally had to use a razor knife to cut it loose. A little risky and tricky, but I got it done and transferred the ring with rubber attached. Only thing I didn't consider during all this today was that the oval metal ring slides on the gauge, so even though the screws are in place the gauge can still shift around a little. I'll worry about that later if it's an issue. But I took the bike around the neighborhood a bit after wrapping things up and the tach and speedo seem fine, and it's nice to have a speedo that works again.

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I swapped over the blue jewel for the neutral light as well, along with the OEM rubber socket and Stanley plastic nut for the jewel. I initially thought I'd make the red indicator in the gauge the neutral light and the blue jewel for high beam, but ran into a roadblock because the high beam socket only has a positive wire and the body of the gauge has to be grounded for the 2 illumination sockets to get ground as well. Interestingly, when I tested the gauge on the bench it worked smoothly with my drill on high speed (42 mph and about 10,000 rpm) but the ride around the neighborhood showed both needles wavered just slightly. So I pulled the tach and speedo inner cables and lubed them up with the marvelous Kable-Ease to see if it helps. After all, the cables are as old as the build and have never previously been lubed.

Happy with how things turned out, looking forward to a short ride before we head out next Tuesday.
 
ancientdad said:
Not knowing much about a CB77, I did not realize the ring around the top of the gauge where the rubber cushion sits (also where the screw holes are for holding the gauge in the headlight case) was not actually part of the gauge. It slides off and the rubber ring goes with it. Well, not easily when it apparently hadn't been removed from the other gauge maybe ever. The rubber was stuck to the bottom of the crimp ring and I literally had to use a razor knife to cut it loose. A little risky and tricky, but I got it done and transferred the ring with rubber attached. Only thing I didn't consider during all this today was that the oval metal ring slides on the gauge, so even though the screws are in place the gauge can still shift around a little. I'll worry about that later if it's an issue. But I took the bike around the neighborhood a bit after wrapping things up and the tach and speedo seem fine, and it's nice to have a speedo that works again.

EU9jODn.jpg


I swapped over the blue jewel for the neutral light as well, along with the OEM rubber socket and Stanley plastic nut for the jewel. I initially thought I'd make the red indicator in the gauge the neutral light and the blue jewel for high beam, but ran into a roadblock because the high beam socket only has a positive wire and the body of the gauge has to be grounded for the 2 illumination sockets to get ground as well. Interestingly, when I tested the gauge on the bench it worked smoothly with my drill on high speed (42 mph and about 10,000 rpm) but the ride around the neighborhood showed both needles wavered just slightly. So I pulled the tach and speedo inner cables and lubed them up with the marvelous Kable-Ease to see if it helps. After all, the cables are as old as the build and have never previously been lubed.

Happy with how things turned out, looking forward to a short ride before we head out next Tuesday.
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Which meter assembly is this one? is this the one you received from Ebay which also came with the headlight and trim ring ?
 
bilbikek411 said:
Which meter assembly is this one? is this the one you received from Ebay which also came with the headlight and trim ring ?
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No, it's the one I bought from @Davomoto. The rubber and retaining ring are from the one I bought from eBay as the gauge from Davomoto did not have either on it.
 
I use a black weatherstripping adhesive by 3M to glue the foam ring on. Someone sells a repop of those thought I saw them on EBay. Didn’t notice that that one had been opened!
 
Davomoto said:
I use a black weatherstripping adhesive by 3M to glue the foam ring on. Someone sells a repop of those thought I saw them on EBay. Didn’t notice that that one had been opened!
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It has been but the crimp was decent and it seems to work well. I did notice a small amount of waver in each one but I pulled the cables and lubed them so we'll see how it looks next ride. The foam ring was well-stuck to the metal ring with the mounting holes, so I transferred them as a unit. Though in hindsight I should have used something to fix the metal ring on the body of the gauge, but I'll deal with it later.
 
Tom,the old style CB77 meter/s I got to you will certainly need to be opened up,to service it.

Did you use your original CL450 tach drive on the new meter? or swap-in that tach. drive you received from the Ebay unit ?
 
I've got a neutral bezel and nut that are all metal, chromed brass, from my '64 Dream. I gave up on the rubber boots, they kept falling off, too old. I use electrical connection boots, like on the starter cable, etc. I've got a bag full, so let me know if you want them.

 
ballbearian said:
I've got a neutral bezel and nut that are all metal, chromed brass, from my '64 Dream. I gave up on the rubber boots, they kept falling off, too old. I use electrical connection boots, like on the starter cable, etc. I've got a bag full, so let me know if you want them.

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You've mentioned those electrical boots before, and thanks for the offer. The new one I splurged on is adequate, but not realizing I'd be buying yet another headlight and gauge assembly at the time that would come with an original in good shape, I now have a good condition original that fits the plastic nut well and seems snug enough that it should hold up under the bumps of riding.

Just curious, is your neutral bezel color green or blue?
 
ancientdad said:
Just curious, is your neutral bezel color green or blue?
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Oh, yes, sorry I was vexed by those rubbers repeatedly.

Early Benlys and Dreams were red but went to blue maybe in '64. The reds were always so faded it was hard to tell. I just used a green sharpie on them to be contrary.
 
The efforts on my bike done, we left early Tuesday and arrived in Hendersonville around 6 pm. Many stops along the way for back and leg pain relief made the trip seem a lot longer than it really was.

We arrived at the cabin to find that the owner/landlord is literally right across the gravel driveway from the cabin, not what was alluded to in the ad and reviews we read. We were told we'd have the use of a covered trailer to park my bike in (and Chris' bike when he got here later in the week), but then we were also told we would get more emails with further information leading up to the week of our arrival. Neither one happened, and I had to email the host for the address at the one week out mark because I had not yet heard from her despite reserving this cabin over 2 months ago. They clearly do not remember the promises they've made, nor do they bother to even speak to you when you arrive because the front door lock on the cabin is an electronic one and they leave it unlocked with the code written down in a guest book inside. And then came the realization that the front door lock was useless when there are 2 sliding doors in the cabin (one of which is in the master bedroom and only feet away from the front door) with broken locks so they can't be secured, so we went out today and bought a small hacksaw and a 6 foot long 3/4" dowel and cut a couple of 33" pieces to make them at least somewhat secure.

So this is the view of the circumstances. Hope it doesn't rain this week.

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Sorry to hear about those failed promises. Sounds like a review will need to left when you leave. Looks like you have somewhat worked around the circumstances though.

Also, I gotta compliment that nice 90’s Chevy truck. My Dad and older brother have owned many of those. If I were to make a guess, 1996 Vortec C1500?
 
Danager4792 said:
Sorry to hear about those failed promises. Sounds like a review will need to left when you leave. Looks like you have somewhat worked around the circumstances though.

Also, I gotta compliment that nice 90’s Chevy truck. My Dad and older brother have owned many of those. If I were to make a guess, 1996 Vortec C1500?
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Thanks, and we've made the situation manageable now.

I was fortunate to buy the truck from the original purchaser, who was also a client of mine for about 10 years. It had 137,000 miles on it, a stack of dealership work orders for all the major services at the proper intervals, and all it needed was an a/c compressor, accumulator, flush and recharge although we also flushed the cooling system and changed it over to conventional coolant. Based on the needed repairs and our long-standing relationship (I've taken great care of their computers for the entire time I've known them), I got the truck for $2000 in August 2020. And you're really close, it's a '95 C1500 (Silverado) with a 5.7 V-8 and a perfect interior and exterior. It spent a lot of time in his garage, literally not one bit of sun damage inside it anywhere. I did a thread on it, you can see more pics of it here.

 
That does bite that you are getting jerked around like that but I hope you can shake it off and just enjoy the the rest of your stay. My wife and I are looking forward to the bike show and meeting everyone on Saturday. We are staying overnight at a local inn which I hope lives up the their advertising.
 
ancientdad said:
Thanks, and we've made the situation manageable now.

I was fortunate to buy the truck from the original purchaser, who was also a client of mine for about 10 years. It had 137,000 miles on it, a stack of dealership work orders for all the major services at the proper intervals, and all it needed was an a/c compressor, accumulator, flush and recharge although we also flushed the cooling system and changed it over to conventional coolant. Based on the needed repairs and our long-standing relationship (I've taken great care of their computers for the entire time I've known them), I got the truck for $2000 in August 2020. And you're really close, it's a '95 C1500 (Silverado) with a 5.7 V-8 and a perfect interior and exterior. It spent a lot of time in his garage, literally not one bit of sun damage inside it anywhere. I did a thread on it, you can see more pics of it here.

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That thing is MINT!! I know that truck has to turn heads at gas stations every now and then. You wouldn’t believe what those trucks go for nowadays. Especially it being a single cab and short wheel base. Chevy hardly makes that combo anymore. You really have to look. And if you find one on marketplace(in your condition), it’s lifted with camo seats and they are asking $12,000 - $15,000.
 
RobMan said:
That does bite that you are getting jerked around like that but I hope you can shake it off and just enjoy the the rest of your stay. My wife and I are looking forward to the bike show and meeting everyone on Saturday. We are staying overnight at a local inn which I hope lives up the their advertising.
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They're minor things overall but I feel like if someone says something or offers something a couple months in advance, they should remember what they said and honor it. Oh, and it's always great when you know you can actually leave the place you're staying knowing that you can secure all the doors and windows. I don't care that it's right next door to the host's house, they may not be home 24/7 to watch. But otherwise the place is new enough that there aren't many other things to be concerned about. We're not made of money and we only do this once a year or so, and like most people we'd like to get our money's worth in these high-priced times.

A great hot corned beef sandwich, potatoes O'Brien and a couple of black and tans at Flanagan's Irish Pub last night helped. (y)
 
ancientdad said:
They're minor things overall but I feel like if someone says something or offers something a couple months in advance, they should remember what they said and honor it. Oh, and it's always great when you know you can actually leave the place you're staying knowing that you can secure all the doors and windows. I don't care that it's right next door to the host's house, they may not be home 24/7 to watch. But otherwise the place is new enough that there aren't many pother things to be concerned about. We're not made of money and we only do this once a year or so, and like most people we'd like to get our money's worth in these high-priced times.

A great hot corned beef sandwich, potatoes O'Brien and a couple of black and tans at Flanagan's Irish Pub last night helped. (y)
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Glad to hear that the rest of the evening got better.
 
Danager4792 said:
That thing is MINT!! I know that truck has to turn heads at gas stations every now and then. You wouldn’t believe what those trucks go for nowadays. Especially it being a single cab and short wheel base. Chevy hardly makes that combo anymore. You really have to look. And if you find one on marketplace(in your condition), it’s lifted with camo seats and they are asking $12,000 - $15,000.
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Yep, I'm not always in the right place at the right time in my life, but that time I was. And other than a minor (but expensive at $875) transmission issue that needed an internal harness replaced for the shift solenoid's pressure regulator, it has been flawless and a joy to own. I could have doubled my money easily later that year or early 2021 the way truck prices soared, but I'm keeping that baby for the long haul. I've since put a low-profile 10" powered sub behind the driver's seat and a new Kenwood CD radio with hands-free bluetooth cell phone use along with a TruXedo LoPro tonneau cover on it. I bought an aftermarket keyless entry for it (I used to install that stuff) but haven't put it in yet, not looking forward to the under-dash part of that job, my back will hate me for it.
 
Looks beautiful up there - although it'd look 10X better without the bike hiding under the cover!
 
I feel like if someone says something or offers something a couple months in advance, they should remember what they said and honor it.
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Tell me about it. We booked our recent week at Sidmouth in Devon a whole year in advance, and that was fine. At the same time, we booked our rabbits and guinea pigs ( the dogs come with us ) in at a local pet boarding place. It's a local one that we've used before. A few days before departure I rang to confirm drop off time, and they denied all knowledge of our booking, even in the face of a copy of the 'WhatsApp' conversation we'd had when making the original booking. Big panic, thoughts of cancelling our week away, resolved at the last minute when another boarding place pointed us toward a place that was open, had capacity and most important, a good reputation.
 
Richard Pitman said:
Tell me about it. We booked our recent week at Sidmouth in Devon a whole year in advance, and that was fine. At the same time, we booked our rabbits and guinea pigs ( the dogs come with us ) in at a local pet boarding place. It's a local one that we've used before. A few days before departure I rang to confirm drop off time, and they denied all knowledge of our booking, even in the face of a copy of the 'WhatsApp' conversation we'd had when making the original booking. Big panic, thoughts of cancelling our week away, resolved at the last minute when another boarding place pointed us toward a place that was open, had capacity and most important, a good reputation.
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Pets are kind of like family;you can hope others who care for them will feel the same.
 
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Just got back from a short local ride down the same road the cabin is on, but the opposite direction from Hendersonville. Turns out it's a very nice road that gets into more elevation changes and quite a few turns as you go further northeast (or so - I've never been like Lewis and Clark, I can get lost in Walmart). I suspect someone put the sign and post there quite a while ago but I don't really think it was ever a gas station in that location, but who really knows except the locals.
 
ancientdad said:
View attachment 31953

Just got back from a short local ride down the same road the cabin is on, but the opposite direction from Hendersonville. Turns out it's a very nice road that gets into more elevation changes and quite a few turns as you go further northeast (or so - I've never been like Lewis and Clark, I can get lost in Walmart). I suspect someone put the sign and post there quite a while ago but I don't really think it was ever a gas station in that location, but who really knows except the locals.
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That’s awesome - bike looks fantastic. I’ve got to go all the way south to Lampassas to find roads like that.
 
EzPete said:
That’s awesome - bike looks fantastic. I’ve got to go all the way south to Lampassas to find roads like that.
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Thanks! I really enjoy the Carolinas every year, the scenery is great and the abundance of awesome riding roads is the reason I keep coming back.
 
Well, Mother Nature is not cooperating. Though the futurecast showed about 25% showers today it seemed it would clear out by 10 AM. But, the forecast keeps getting revised as the line of showers keeps hanging around... so the light rain continues and the temp is dropping as well. Doesn't look good for today. :(
 
ancientdad said:
Well, Mother Nature is not cooperating. Though the futurecast showed about 25% showers today it seemed it would clear out by 10 AM. But, the forecast keeps getting revised as the line of showers keeps hanging around... so the light rain continues and the temp is dropping as well. Doesn't look good for today. :(
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At least you're not tent camping. It's all relative, eh?
 
stl360+450 said:
But is the bike still tent camping??
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It is, again. After that short ride and cool-down period yesterday, I put the cover back on and it sat covered in the steady light rain all day today. The cover isn't waterproof, so before dark today I took it off and was surprised, it wasn't very wet at all. Dried it off, ran the cover in the dryer for a few minutes and covered it up again. Opportunity lost. We're going to try to get in a little riding before the show tomorrow, since everything we'll be doing is in a 20 mile radius or so.
 
ancientdad said:
Rather than worry about checking full advance on it anymore since it doesn't idle well once warmed up, I decided to adjust the limiter tabs on the advancer a bit and then lock it at full advance, then adjust the points and plate to set the timing statically at the last full advance mark.
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I think you had mentioned in the four year maintenance thread that you leave your hand on the throttle to keep bike running at idle. Am I remembering correctly?

ancientdad said:
A little bit of carb adjustments at idle will get done before the trip, though nothing dramatic is necessary.
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When I read this I was wondering if your goal would be to get it to idle on its own. I am also curious about the size of your pilot jet in the Mikuni and whether you made any change there.

Maybe I'm misremembering the discussion from the four year thread, so feel free to straighten me out if that's the case.
 
stl360+450 said:
I think you had mentioned in the four year maintenance thread that you leave your hand on the throttle to keep bike running at idle. Am I remembering correctly?
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You are correct, the long duration camshafts contribute to the weak idle. After the tune-up this year the timing was just a degree or two more advanced at idle and I had to drop the idle speed screws a tiny bit, which didn't help things. It idles better cold than hot, but with the slight change in the idle speed screws it's less inclined to idle cold now as well.
stl360+450 said:
When I read this I was wondering if your goal would be to get it to idle on its own. I am also curious about the size of your pilot jet in the Mikuni and whether you made any change there.

Maybe I'm misremembering the discussion from the four year thread, so feel free to straighten me out if that's the case.
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I have no idea what pilot jets are in the Mikunis, it wasn't something I worried about because of the known weak idle. I adjusted the mixture screws a little bit before the trip but there's not a lot of change no matter. Being very used to the behavior I just hold the idle manually and operate around it, so to speak. One day I'll put a fan on it, clamp the bike vertical on the lift and play with the carbs to see if I can improve things but it's only a minor irritant, nothing more, and having tons of experience with the drag bike and the same camshafts back in the day, it's never been a big deal to me.
 
ancientdad said:
Being very used to the behavior I just hold the idle manually and operate around it, so to speak. One day I'll put a fan on it, clamp the bike vertical on the lift and play with the carbs to see if I can improve things but it's only a minor irritant, nothing more, and having tons of experience with the drag bike and the same camshafts back in the day, it's never been a big deal to me.
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This makes sense. I guess I'm just curious about whether the idle could be corrected with a simple jet change, but I can imagine how your vast riding experience makes it a non-factor. A less experienced rider might end up stalling the bike after a sudden stop by forgetting to nurse the idle in the heat of the moment.
 
stl360+450 said:
A less experienced rider might end up stalling the bike after a sudden stop by forgetting to nurse the idle in the heat of the moment.
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It happens to me now and then too, more from the multiple acts of hard braking with both hand and foot as well as clutching and downshifting all at once. In fact, when returning to the cabin after the 5 video segment ride to Lake Lure and back it happened as I came to the last stop sign. I blasted first gear one last time and had to stop in a hurry and it stalled on me. A nice comfy idle would be great, but the engine is far from stock so I just let it be itself. In the past when I've had the idle speed set higher, it floats down to idle sometimes as a result and it's still inconsistent due to the cams (and maybe mixtures too since I haven't bothered with them much). Hey, it was intended to work right at all rpms above idle while using the power it has, who cares about the low rpm stuff! :)
 
ancientdad said:
A nice comfy idle would be great, but the engine is far from stock so I just let it be itself.
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I don't know anything (zero experience) about those long duration cams, which, I guess, makes me naive enough to want to try different size pilot jets. Do you expect that a change in pilot jet could adversely affect the above-idle performance?

When I first got my CB450 it would occasionally stall when I stopped hard and, without the electric start, that can be a little stressful. Once I was in the left lane on a local interstate and there was a bumper to bumper slow down. Creeping one car length at a time, the bike stalled while idling. I felt very vulnerable as I was kicking it over and held the idle at about 2k until I had clear pavement in front of me again. Fortunately, the idle is much more stable these days.
 
stl360+450 said:
I don't know anything (zero experience) about those long duration cams, which, I guess, makes me naive enough to want to try different size pilot jets. Do you expect that a change in pilot jet could adversely affect the above-idle performance?
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I don't know, though it might. I may be wrong in my interpretation of the reasoning, but with long duration the intake valves open sooner than usual and allow the incoming intake charge to be contaminated with leftover exhaust as it's leaving, plus the exhaust valves close late as well furthering the issue at low rpm. The whole idea behind long duration is the way it operates at high rpm - things happen so much faster that the duration length becomes a positive part of the intake and exhaust process. Intake valves open sooner to get a 'head start' on the cylinder filling process, and the exhaust valves open sooner to maximize the clearing out process. Additionally, the overlap between them is longer too which at low rpm allows more contamination of the intake charges as they're drawn in. To some extent, this is what makes a cammed-up V-8 have a 'bumpy' idle, some cylinders running at lower efficiency at moments because the camshaft is designed to breathe the best at a higher rpm range.
stl360+450 said:
When I first got my CB450 it would occasionally stall when I stopped hard and, without the electric start, that can be a little stressful. Once I was in the left lane on a local interstate and there was a bumper to bumper slow down. Creeping one car length at a time, the bike stalled while idling. I felt very vulnerable as I was kicking it over and held the idle at about 2k until I had clear pavement in front of me again. Fortunately, the idle is much more stable these days.
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It happens to me at times too and it can put pressure on you to get moving as fast as possible, especially in these times of shorter patience levels in traffic and the potential for someone to start road-raging on you. I usually just 'paddle' my way to the side of the road, then slow down and deal with it at my own speed. It almost always fires right back up in one kick since I keep it in proper tune all the time, but on mine I have to fold the right footpeg up to allow the kickstarter to get a full stroke as well as find neutral so it isn't as quick as most motorists would want in these impatient times. I have considered putting the electric start back on the bike because in the beginning I was concerned about weight for the performance aspects, but now that it's built and has made its drag strip runs it isn't as important anymore. But then I'd either have to add a left handlebar switch for a single-wired button for the horn, or rig a relay for when the engine is off the button becomes the electric start and when running it goes back to being the horn button. Not a big deal with the thousand of relays I've wired for oddball door lock, remote start and valet operations on aftermarket security systems I put in over a 10 year span of doing car accessories.
 
Thanks for the explanation of the long duration cams — that makes a lot of sense. So, the leftover exhaust gases would have greater amounts of non-combustibles, making it harder to create optimal conditions for the next combustion event.

Edit: I did a little reading and maybe I understand the throttle blipping better now. At low rpm the percentage of recycled exhaust gases can increase with each turn, ultimately leading to a mix that won't fire. Blip the throttle and the rpm increases and the breathing improves, clearing out the exhaust gases. A thread on sohc was suggesting that a leaner idle mixture can sometimes help, which makes sense. I would imagine that changes to the mixture screw or pilot jet shouldn't do much to your performance at high rpm, but I can understand not wanting to mess up what you have.
 
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Since I didn't get much time to do a proper shakedown of the changes made to the headlight and tach/speedo situation, the ride to the show and the ride to Lake Lure and back combined to reveal some deficiencies in the assemblage of parts. so the 450 is back on the lift to suss out the latest round of little needs and changes, like better gauge retention so it isn't affected by the movement of the tach and speedo cables and why the hell my headlight quit working completely which is probably old sloppy bullet connector(s) (ground probably). Because of that I wasn't able to test my theory of the little 4 amp battery handling a typical ride with a 55 watt low beam at all rpm ranges with the charging system at full blast all the time.

And now it's lovebug time here, followed by the 600° pizza oven. Ugh.
 
^^^Your site needs a "Commiserate" button. If I gave you a "Like" it would almost be adding insult to injury. Just remember that this is a hobby and you do it for fun and relaxation!
 
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