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Rickman CL175…a true Metisse!

Jays100

Veteran Member
Joined
May 29, 2020
Total Posts
1,093
Total likes
609
Location
Enfield, CT USA
There are a number of the micro Metisse Rickman’s that one sees from time to time. I’ve always wanted one of the 650cc triumph versions but have never seemed to be right place, right time.

I was enjoying myself reading a Rickman thread on advrider and happened on a micro Metisse photo that someone had transplanted a cd125 twin into the micro frame and it looked so cool!

I’ve accumulated several engines to do the oil pimp upgrade (well, I’m the pimp, it’s the oil pump I’m really talking about). I happened to peruse F’book marketplace and ran across this, for reasonable money…it’s pretty rough.
 
I’m not in any hurry to finish this project, have to accumulate some parts.
First on the list is a Yamaha AT1/CT1 rear wheel assy. Yeah, that and a plethora of parts to fix what’s rusted and had to be ground off. Anyone have a wheel to donate to the cause?
 
Interesting,'oil pimp'... ;)

My cousin once had a Rickman Metisse, but I can't recall the engine it had though I'm fairly sure it was a 2 stroke 250, it was back in the late '70s I think. Very nice frame for sure. This should be cool.
 
I'd love to do a VanTech CB160. This is going to be really cool to follow. Are you going to play with fiberglass?
 
The one pricey part of my plan is the fiberglass. It appears to be just as cost effective to buy new from the UK as it is funky used here. Still, that part is $500 + shipping so I may have to get creative.
 
The one pricey part of my plan is the fiberglass. It appears to be just as cost effective to buy new from the UK as it is funky used here. Still, that part is $500 + shipping so I may have to get creative.
If you only had one to wrap in plastic and make a rigid foam mold from......
 
Interesting,'oil pimp'... ;)

My cousin once had a Rickman Metisse, but I can't recall the engine it had though I'm fairly sure it was a 2 stroke 250, it was back in the late '70s I think. Very nice frame for sure. This should be cool.
It was a nickel plated frame, always thought that was cool. It was a Montesa 250cc engine
 
I know Rickman frames are nickel plated;what type of steel do they use before it's plated ? Chromoly ?

I have heard of a Rickman owner needing to weld the 'tabs',etc. back on his frame and he's up in Canada;he was bringing it to a special welder to have the work done,then later he had the frame plated again.
 
I know Rickman frames are nickel plated;what type of steel do they use before it's plated ? Chromoly ?

I have heard of a Rickman owner needing to weld the 'tabs',etc. back on his frame and he's up in Canada;he was bringing it to a special welder to have the work done,then later he had the frame plated again.
Yikes, can't help you with that one!
 
Got this off Google: Where most British bike frames employed cast iron lugs and mild steel tubing, a Rickman chassis is large diameter Reynolds tubing, carefully fit and brazed together, then nickel plated. The end result was a bike weighing 30 to 40 pounds less than a factory machine.
 
Yup, Reynolds 531, a somewhat relative to 4130 but was specifically formulated for brazing. I haven’t weighed it but it’s not a featherweight frame. Still, it does feel lighter than stock. 20 v 30 lbs , in that neighborhood.
 
This is brilliant, watching with interest. I now wish that I'd weighed my bare SL175 frame when I had the chance, wonder how it would compare with the Rickman frame ?

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Yup, Reynolds 531, a somewhat relative to 4130 but was specifically formulated for brazing. I haven’t weighed it but it’s not a featherweight frame. Still, it does feel lighter than stock. 20 v 30 lbs , in that neighborhood.
Their double butted bicycle tubing was not heat treated and was a favorite, especially for touring and long road racing. It was not heat treated though and did become whippy over much time.
 
I’m not in any hurry to finish this project, have to accumulate some parts.
First on the list is a Yamaha AT1/CT1 rear wheel assy. Yeah, that and a plethora of parts to fix what’s rusted and had to be ground off. Anyone have a wheel to donate to the cause?
Good, that means many more detailed photos of that wonderful frame. I've got a very sad complete title-less 76 125 enduro that I'll never get to, is that what you need?
 
Interesting,'oil pimp'... ;)

My cousin once had a Rickman Metisse, but I can't recall the engine it had though I'm fairly sure it was a 2 stroke 250, it was back in the late '70s I think. Very nice frame for sure. This should be cool.
I believe the 250 2 stroke will be a Montesa.
 
I'm not sure but think it may be Reynolds 531 molybdinum-manganese tubing all fillet brazed.
Pretty sure your right about that.
Reynolds 531 was the 'ultimate' frame tubing in the 60's and 70's.
There's a guy in North Wales making Rickman frame replica's, all fillet brazed.
He would probably know (and remember) more of the history as I haven't read up on the Rickman Zundapp 125 since the 70's when a friend had one
 
I just had to look it up.
Seems they are now in Gloucester

Just read through some of the other stuff, not the guy I was thinking of so I guess there are two people making Rickman frames?
 
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Pretty sure your right about that.
Reynolds 531 was the 'ultimate' frame tubing in the 60's and 70's.
There's a guy in North Wales making Rickman frame replica's, all fillet brazed.
He would probably know (and remember) more of the history as I haven't read up on the Rickman Zundapp 125 since the 70's when a friend had one
That's pretty sweet. The time it takes to miter and fit each joint before brazing is some fine craftsmanship.
 
Back then I really wanted the 441 and when BSA closed down selling everything to Alan Clews, a CCM 500 or the later 580.
The development of the BSA C15, (250cc single) into larger and larger engine sizes was cool in my opinion (plus, I had done a lot of work on C15's in early 70's)
Never was committed enough to spend the money though (by the time I saved cash, something else 'more important' always came along)
 
I remember the man/sohc4 member up in Ontario,CAN. with the CB750 Rickman former race bike which he's making into a street machine;he still posts onto his thread about it occasionally,but it's on the 'back burner' for now.
He said it was only supposed to be brazed rather than welded.
 
I'm not sure but think it may be Reynolds 531 molybdinum-manganese tubing all fillet brazed.
I have a 1986 Made in Wisconsin,USA frame 61cm(c.to c.)Trek 'Elance' mod. D400 bicycle which is made from Reynolds 531 tubing. This one is a type of low-end sport/race bike,although the frame is still stiff when it needs to carry my 225lb. self. I think this type of tubing would make an excellent touring bicycle because it's comfortable when it hits bumps. I imagine it makes good motorcycle frames also.
 
@ballbearian if it's complete, would hate to bust it up. I found a hub/brake assembly for cheap ($23!)and pulled the trigger. Now, need the Ceriani MX forks (from Penton or CanAm mx/enduro) and Bultaco front wheel. ($$$). have found one in nice shape but I'm not quite ready to pull that trigger.

The Micro Metisse used steel rims (which I hate) so will change those over to the H rib Akront style if i can find a set.

The engine needs both cam bearings, an advancer, pistons... for OEM parts. I'll have to fab a single carb manifold to use the Zundapp airbox. But I'll get there.

I haven't figured out the swingarm bearing scheme either, making me crazy. looks like they're the similar to what Honda used on the CT70 - that rubberized bushing thingy.

You can still get Metisse frame kits, now made by the Wasp folks, and all the other parts from the UK (though I've not found the micro bits to be listed). I'm thinking if I can make a rolling/running bike for under $1000, I'll have had a ton of fun and an amazingly unique bike.
 
Reading period ride reviews, the bike with Zundapp engine weighed in at 187# (194 with 1/2 fuel) and had a noticeable rearward weight bias which made it a wheelie machine. Adding an additional 15-25# engine weight should balance that out nicely.

I'm also on the fence on turn signals and lights for a gravel runner. Yay? Nay? (really it's a "should it be street legal" question)

Have sourced a plater locally too, cost of that really scares me! Ya just can't have a Rickman without a nickel plated frame, ya just can't! But again, tomorrow's decision.

Will this have high pipes like the 125? or mid pipes like the 650's? So far, envisioning a run of siamesed pipes in the same routing as the 125, but I'm fickle and will likely change my mind at least twice and that only after having already built it. Am also thinking no muffler but to use small-ish diameter tubes to sorta control noise? I don't have a feel for this engine's character.
 
I don't think I knew about these back then but it would've been a pie in the sky dream bike. I wonder when it was made? What a cool project. I still want a VanTech, have you ever seen one of those?
I have a small (17") Kawasaki front wheel complete if you want.
 
Oh yeah, Rickman built kits so there were Bultaco engines, Montessa, Villiers, Yamaha, Zundapp, Hodaka, etc! If you were thinking there were complete bikes, well, Steens, the importer did order batches. But if you put your bitsa together, it fits into the Metisse theme (the French for mongrel) and they're still being built.

Incidentally, senor' Bulto and the Rickmans didn't ultimately get along so the Rickman designed and built Bultaco frames ended up into the Pursang (from the French for pure bred).

Useless trivia I know.
 
@ballberian, thank you! but the front is a 21" (so far) needs to be from a Bultaco - just because the brake anchor is more flexible.
 
I can look. Do you know if the heads are interchangeable?

And I like the exhaust run!
Pretty sure all the vertical 175 heads are interchangeable, we just didn't get the actual CD version, the US model was the CA175.
 
As Tom says, heads are interchangeable, same camshaft ( later CDs had a detachable cam sprocket, not that that makes any difference.) Left side cam bearing (points side) cam bearing same on both, right hand CD cam bearing doesn't have the tacho drive. CB right side bearing can be fitted, as can CB200 right side, for that matter. Valves, rockers, etc all the same.

( At the risk of upsetting CD175 owners, the UK spec CD was in some respects the poor mans version, lacking an electric start, only 6v electrics and a four speed gear cluster. Gears and electrics mix and match with the CB version. Only had a SLS front brake, along with 17" wheels. Weird throttle and twist grip assembly, buried inside the handlebar.

On the plus side, it had a fully enclosed drive chain, deep mudguards ( fenders ), single larger carb, making tuning easier, possibly better fuel economy.

In other markets, it got 12v and electric start, CB styling still with single carb.)

1696966124545.png
 
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Thanks, I'm starting from below the bottom on this one so any help or further information is appreciated!
 
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Today is nice out so I’m working on wheels. Still in the disassembly, cleaning, fitting…you know what that’s all about.

In the past/for another project, I bought a Kaw KDX450 for its frame and have most of the bits and pieces left over to help this build. The front wheel is todays work, and work it is. The spokes are seized, rim bent…but the hub is in perfect condition.

IMG_2436.jpeg
 
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The rear hub, from a Yamaha CT1 is gross but it’s structurally sound. It has a cushion drive and uses a 428 chain. It’ll get black paint once it’s cleaned properly. Here’s a pic of the two hubs together.

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And the cushion drive parts.
 
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I’ve searched high and low for affordable Ceriani MX or Betor forks and Curnutt shocks that are in good condition with limited or no success. Because of my sources overseas for my pump parts, I’ve found fully adjustable rear shocks, new forks/triples/bearings for the same money that folks want for serviceable used parts. New rims and spokes too.

They’re due next week.

I’ve mentioned I’m not a purist, especially when it comes making a bike from a bare frame. Perhaps if I had started with a complete bike my approach would be different.

I’m actually kind of excited the type and style of parts that are coming together.

Oh, and the gas tank is from a Mutt Mash, bought a lot time ago with thoughts to make an affordable CL replacement. The differences are too large to overcome but here, somehow it fits! New and with a fuel level sender included. How cool is that.

Perhaps a Trail Tech dash?
 
The rear hub, from a Yamaha CT1 is gross but it’s structurally sound. It has a cushion drive and uses a 428 chain. It’ll get black paint once it’s cleaned properly.
Man, 6 studs for the sprocket on a 175 engined-bike. Yamaha must have thought their CT1 had more power than it really did. Cool hub though, as well as the conical front hub. And what exactly is a Mutt Mash??
 
Just FYI, don't upload them in bunches because they won't go to the page in order if done that way.
 
Good Grief, I hadn't realised that those Mutt atrocities had made it across the pond. Assembled in Birmingham UK from Chinese parts, selling 125cc bikes on Chinese knobbly tyres to inexperienced youngsters, recipe for disaster on cold wet UK tarmac. Thoroughly nasty things, again just IMHO.
 
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