CB350 Re-spoking first timer.

[GaryJames]

I have always shied away from anything to do with spokes but this time I decided to give it a go.

First side lacing didn't go so good as I got all the way around and I was one hole out so out they all came and try again.

IMG_2172.jpg

Turn the wheel over and do the other side:

IMG_2173.jpg

Then axel through the wheel and into the vice to true up the out of round first using a DTI magnetic base on the vice rear anvil.
After about an hour of fiddling about a bit here and a bit there I got out of round to under 40 thou which I think is okay according to a US based older guy on Youtube
who apparently does lots of motorcycle wheels.
Then DTI'd the side run out and managed to get the also to under 40 thou....

Then on with the tyre.

IMG_2174.jpg
This pic is sort of showing how I used the DTI.
Only problem was after pumping up to 33 PSI the tyre was not setting evenly around the rim and had introduced serious out of round again! I had to let some air out and manually encourage the low areas up the rim.
Eventually it seated okay.

IMG_2175.jpg

Using Shinko ribbed 3.00 as front tyre.
I will post on the rear wheel build later.

I am happy but proof will be when venturing out on the road..

cheers

Gary

[LongDistanceRider]

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, spec for runout, vertical and lateral, is .020" max. Per the FSM

[GaryJames]

Oh, well I better put it back in the vice and tune it some more…
thanks LDR.
Gary.

[GaryJames]

LDR, meantime I found this reference on VHT which referred to minimum tolerances for runout and roundness at 2mm which is about 78 thou.
https://www.vintagehondatwins.com/fo...2&d=1658164707

but I will try and retune it to better than 40.
have you done this with the tyre on.?
I can’t find you measurement I’d 20 thou in the FSM as yet… still looking.
Gary

[Boomer343]

Used rims can be nasty to get into spec or even close. Throw a tube type tire on and it can drive you crazy. In a couple situations either for reducing the balance weights or for out of round issues I have marked the high spot and moved it 180 or whatever my best guess is. Have to take the tire off, tube out and then mount again.

I've never found the CB/CL350's too fussy about small tire/rim issues.

[Alan F.]

I've seen the 2mm figure in print for a few different bikes.

One tip I've been using is: once spokes are tight, before truing a wheel go around the perimeter and give each spoke nipple a sharp hit with a hammer & brass drift to positively seat the nipples to the wheel. Then true the wheel.

[ballbearian]

I'm pretty sure 2mm is what he meant. Even brand new rims probably aren't within .02". Also try to have the rim centered over the hub or the bike will tend to track to one side. You could flip the wheel over using your method and adjust each side until it's the same measured distance. I prefer to have the rim bare until it's true and evenly dished and fully tensioned because I can observe both sides of the rim at the same time. Can't do that with the tire on, our eyeballs aren't far enough apart.

[ballbearian]

Here is my wheel rig. Just an old swing arm and clips.

[Ribrickulous]

.020” is the factory value - what a brand new rim should come in at.

≈.070” is the service limit - may be higher as noted above.

My front wheel which I haven’t touched is at about .030” and I was able to get my rear wheel, which is an aftermarket replacement, to about .025”.

.040” is acceptable, but if you’ve got free time you can chase more.

Make sure to ride for a few miles and double check nothing has come undone or snapped, then again at 50, 100, and should be good after that.

Are these aftermarket rims and spokes or OEM?

The aftermarket Thai spokes I bought were absolute garbage. Threw them out and rebuilt it with OEM on an aftermarket rim.


- 1972 CL350
- 1985 VF700F

[GaryJames]

Thanks all for the advice.
Ribrickulous, the rims are the original Honda rims, marked with width and some manufacturing numbers and symbols.
Spokes were from Common Motors so I assume are reasonable quality.
Having said that, the PO dropped the bike on the left hand side and there are a few scuffs and scratches around the rim edge.
BB, I like the idea of using an old swinging arm for a wheel mount, I will try and get a second hand one here in nz. Although mounting in the vice seemed to work okay.

Cheers

Gary

[GaryJames]

Got some quality time in the garage last two days ( after the family and grand kids departed!!! it is a lot quieter too.)
Front wheel mounted and cycle guard on.
Small question regarding the right hand throttle control but will list that in the appropriate section.

IMG_2191.jpg fullsizeoutput_2d4d.jpg

cheers

Gary

[ballbearian]

You're a wheelwright now. Nice work on the hub centers too, they look great.

[Boomer343]

I always do what I call the "ting test". Small wrench hits each spoke after truing, looking for a reasonably sharp ting sound. If it's a flat ting it means the spoke isn't tight enough. Basically you are looking for a consistent sound, it isn't an exacting tune your guitar method.

[LongDistanceRider]

Nice Gary

[GaryJames]

Boomer, yes I did the ting test while doing the final tightening. All pretty much the same.
cheers
Gary

[GaryJames]

BB commented on the hub centres saying how good they looked so I thought I would show what they are painted in.
In fact all the engine cases except the barrels and head are painted the same way.
all including the wheel hubs and brake plates were soda blasted first.
IMG_2193.jpg
This the hi temp paint I used. K&H from Australia.
Colour is Engine Enamel Magnesium Alloy.
I tried several Silver shades but this has the best "sparkly" look.
The paint progressively hardens each time it reaches 180 C .
there is a small amount if lead in it.

Gary

AD, no matter what I do with my iPhone camera, portrait or landscape the pic's just refuse to upload from my iMac the right way up.
Even if I rotate them in Mac photo app. sorry.

[ancientdad]

AD, no matter what I do with my iPhone camera, portrait or landscape the pic's just refuse to upload from my iMac the right way up.
Even if I rotate them in Mac photo app. sorry.

Gary, no worries, at least you are aware and trying to correct them. I'm not sure what the reason is and with no experience on a Mac with any of the available adjustments, I can't suggest anything. I usually correct pics that are sideways but on this one it isn't necessary.

[GaryJames]

This afternoon got the rear wheel spoked, trued laterally to under 20 thou. Out of round to 15 thou.
much easier to do on this rear wider rim.
the original rim was badly rusted and I managed to find this one on our version of eBay in NZ, Trademe.
supposedly off a CB350 but the rim has no stamped numbers and measures 78 mm across the tyre beads.
my rusty one is 70 mm. The new Shinzo 3.5 x18 went okay so I think it will be alright.
I wonder if the rim is from a CB360?
DF9FBF29-8163-4E87-874E-98FD93F3E1F3.jpg
Sigh, once again the pic is sideways….

cheers

Gary

[bilbikek411]

The wheel looks good Gary.

[GaryJames]

I am happy with how things are starting to look.
I just noticed the rim witness mark is good all around the rim on one side but below the rim for about 4 inches perimeter on the other.
I will deflate and try and hand massage it higher at that point.
I did silicon grease the tyre bead edges so they would slide into place as inflation pressure built up…must be a sticky part.
Probably need to use my compressor to quickly inflate instead of slowly with the foot pump!
Gary

[bilbikek411]

I inflate tires,to inflate them fast use a compressor tank(above 80 psi)and seat the beads(works best on tubeless also)with the tire stem's/inner valve core removed so the tire will inflate faster w/ less resistance;then once the tire is seated on both beads,re-install/screw-in the inner valve stem core and fill to the recommended pressure.

[GaryJames]

Thanks bilbike,
yes I plan to drag my compressor out tomorrow and do it the way you describe.

funny how things to do with wheels come in threes…
as I am going camping 8 jan for 8 days in the northern Coromandel in NZ I had to get the wof done on my camping trailer this morning.
so I hitched it up and noticed at was very hard to pull to the tow bar( I believe the word is hitch in US speak )
notice one tyre was completely flat.
put the foot pump on and pumped away to no effect, noticed the rubber stalk with the inflation valve was split.
checked the spare and the other wheel and all were starting to split….spent rest of my morning visiting the tyre place to have the valves replaced. Tubeless wheels.
glad I got this done before venturing 4 hours into the countryside!
wof= warrant of fitness.

cheers
Gary

[ballbearian]

And here I thought the wof kept the rain out.

Also check the rim strip hasn't slipped out of the middle and is under a part of the bead, while it is deflated completely.

[GaryJames]

Ha ha BB, that would be woof then?

quaint vehicle physical check we have had in NZ for many years.
used to be 6 monthly but that was beginning to be a $$rort for the checkers .
now it is 12 monthly as vehicles are more reliable now although people still run worn down tires which are dangerous.
in the 20’s 30’s 40’s and 50’s steering geometry and suspension in the front of cars ( mostly British sourced )was accomplished using King Pins which were notorious for wear if not regularly greased. We still had a heap of these cars on the road in NZ into the 70’s and I can recall seeing them meander down the road from side to side so I suppose wof checks saved a few lives….i got my driving license at age 15 in one such car.

cheers
Gary

[GaryJames]

Mean to add that the rubber bead strip has a strip of masking tape over it so it won’t move and may let the tyre retain some pressure in case of puncture.
Gary

[GaryJames]

Had a busy family Xmas and new year....we celebrate this in summer in NZ so most families are on annual holidays.
However I got some garage time in and completed the rear wheel.
In the frame but waiting for new main drive chain to arrive.
Gary350.jpg

Other work done in the "Frame" section.

cheers

Gary