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CL Muffler Question

rrrandall

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Jan 20, 2024
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Phoenix, Arizona
I have a late CL77 muffler that came with a group of parts. This is the one with one pipe welded to the muffler. Someone sawed it off the exhaust pipe, so there is a short stub on one inlet.

If the remaining piece of the exhaust pipe (welded in the muffler) is removed, could it be used on an earlier year with the slide-on muffler, or are there differences in the muffler design or inlets? It has really nice chrome, so I wanted to check if it can be modified for my 1965 CL77.

Thanks.

Dick Randall
 
That’s a good question. The slide on earlier muffler and silicone seals that attach it to the pipes are not cheap, when they can be found. A possible issue with the shortened cutoff pipes if you were able to attach that setup is the inner bracket to suspend the muffler to the frame/fender, may no longer align properly.

Another solution may be to find or build the inner baffles that were also used before the guppy muffler option was installed. These parts are also shown on a parts fiche. These just slide into the pipes about 10” and bolt to the inside pipe section for retention.

Then there’s the loud and proud SnufforNots an aftermarket open pipe washer baffle that I am sure is quite loud when on the throttle. o_O
 
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michael said:
Snuff R Nots are available? Still?
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I think anything is available if your patient and keep looking for certain parts for these 305cc models. I found a NOS set of Honda slide needles for the carbs after a year long search for my build. I just bought a NOS cam chain tensioner, as a worn one was my only option when I did the rebuild, since they were not available in a worldwide search.
Just recently a Thailand vendor listed two NOS tensioners for sale along with a NOS stator assembly, both of which were NLA two years ago at build time. I posted the sellers info in the vendor section and grabbed one of the tensioners.

Not exactly an original Snuff R Not and too big in size, yet an option to custom build that is cheaper if the neighbours are OK with a little bark. ;)

www.ebay.com

2-1/4" Snuff or Not Pipe Baffle Set | eBay

Snuff or not baffle pipe set for 2-1/4" tube style baffles for added back pressure. Sold in a quantity of 2.
www.ebay.com
 
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Hi, I'll weigh in with Flyin. Anything is possible when working on our scramblers. When the 250 Scrambler came out in '62 it had a set of baffles that would fit your pipes. The guppy muffler with some ingenuity may work on your exhaust. Keep in mind the muffler needs to be supported using the rear fender. Another option is to look for a complete set of pipes for that model year with/without the muffler. Then you have options. I own a CL77 with that set-up. I found a set of pipes and installed the snuff or nots. Now I can run either way or return to stock. Yes, It took patience and time, the parts are out there. Good luck!
 
I just went through this situation on my CL77 , Bill Silver found both pipes to short after removing the top welded guppy , in order for the brackets to line up and correct lengths I had to spring for replacement originals and are out for rechroming now . 4into 1 has 1 3/8ths os diameter baffles which will not fit into the pipes , some metal will need to be removed for proper fitting. Any snuffrnots out there? Thanks Jim
 
Johnnydarkgt350 said:
I just went through this situation on my CL77 , Bill Silver found both pipes to short after removing the top welded guppy , in order for the brackets to line up and correct lengths I had to spring for replacement originals and are out for rechroming now . 4into 1 has 1 3/8ths os diameter baffles which will not fit into the pipes , some metal will need to be removed for proper fitting. Any snuffrnots out there? Thanks Jim
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That’s what I alluded to in my original post as a possible issue. Once the pipes are cut and a muffler is slid on the shorter pipes the rear bracket will not align to the rear fender mount.

If the poster wants to use his original pipes then likely the internal baffles as shown on a parts fiche if they can be found or fabricated. The Snuff R Nots can also be found or reproduced as a final option.
 
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My CL350 before I found a stock exhaust for it. I think it looks better than the big, OEM rectangular box with the black heat shield, but it was too loud. I made a bracket that bolted to both mufflers and attached to the stock frame clamp. Not a “stock looking” setup, but it made the bike usable till I found a better exhaust.
FullSizeRender.jpeg
 
Not the best looking system I admit, but it ran well and sounded great, deep and throaty without being loud. A left side Triumph Speed Triple silencer fitted to a custom made stainless steel Y piece. I ran it like this until I found a NOS Honda system for it.

gfLbFoK.jpg


hXWjJ5s.jpg
 
1969 CL350 said:
My CL350 before I found a stock exhaust for it. I think it looks better than the big, OEM rectangular box with the black heat shield, but it was too loud. I made a bracket that bolted to both mufflers and attached to the stock frame clamp. Not a “stock looking” setup, but it made the bike usable till I found a better exhaust.
View attachment 28943
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Turn signal delete?
 
eamartin said:
Turn signal delete?
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Yes. The wiring harness is messed up, and the original signals were pitted pretty badly. I eventually bought some good used ones, but they were for looks only. I have a good wiring harness for it now, but I’m not too motivated to install it, since electric turn signals aren’t required on motorcycles in Alabama. I just use hand signals…

The headlight isn’t stock, either, and the on/off switch is that toggle on top. The headlight, tail light, brake light, and charging system all work fine, though.

IMG_1138.jpeg
 
1969 CL350 said:
Yes. The wiring harness is messed up, and the original signals were pitted pretty badly. I eventually bought some good used ones, but they were for looks only. I have a good wiring harness for it now, but I’m not too motivated to install it, since electric turn signals aren’t required on motorcycles in Alabama. I just use hand signals…

The headlight isn’t stock, either, and the on/off switch is that toggle on top. The headlight, tail light, brake light, and charging system all work fine, though.

View attachment 28981
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Thanks for clarifying. I was pretty sure those bikes always came with the turn signals. Nice looking CL. How about the chrome headlight shell? Were those OEM back then?
 
eamartin said:
Thanks for clarifying. I was pretty sure those bikes always came with the turn signals. Nice looking CL. How about the chrome headlight shell? Were those OEM back then?
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The headlight is a chrome Emgo halogen unit, copy of a later model Honda shell. It fits great and is much brighter than the old Honda headlight. The bike originally came with a steel headlight shell, painted white to match the side covers and lower part of the gas tank.

IMG_0835.jpeg
 
The Snuff or Nots are now almost impossible to locate. There is a set on eBay currently, the SO25's which are too small the the CL77, they are listed for $149.00, they cost $1.95 new. You need the SO50,s for the 305 Scrambler. I did find a set for the last one I restored and paid dearly for them. For my current project, I am looking but not optimistic about finding any. I am looking at other options, CA baffles cut down, after market 1 3/8" shorty cheapo's (yes you do have to grind them down to fit correctly), or making a set of homemade snuffs. Stuff you run through your head when you can't sleep at night......
 
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boddy said:
Found this on the Hodaka forum site. Made from eye bolts and washers
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That's an interesting idea. I've been thinking about what I could add to my straight pipes to cut down a little on the loudness, I'm going to give something like that a try.
 
ancientdad said:
That's an interesting idea. I've been thinking about what I could add to my straight pipes to cut down a little on the loudness, I'm going to give something like that a try.
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Don't the originals have a center hole? Instead of a bolt, maybe weld the eyebolt to the washer and leave a 1/2" hole in the middle.
 
ballbearian said:
Don't the originals have a center hole? Instead of a bolt, maybe weld the eyebolt to the washer and leave a 1/2" hole in the middle.
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I’ve seen originals with one center hole, and others with 3 smaller holes, which would work with that eye bolt design. It looks pretty fiddly to assemble it in a straight pipe, though.
 
1969 CL350 said:
I’ve seen originals with one center hole, and others with 3 smaller holes, which would work with that eye bolt design. It looks pretty fiddly to assemble it in a straight pipe, though.
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The ones I've seen were only about a half inch from the end of the pipe. Probably needs a stout coil spring to keep tension and prevent rattling.

Plus a nice kitchen knob from the homodecoratus section.
 
1969 CL350 said:
I’ve seen originals with one center hole, and others with 3 smaller holes, which would work with that eye bolt design
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I think the idea was to set the washer at a certain angle of opening and then lock it in place. Of course drilling holes in the washer would work as well
 
I'm sure you could work with that design and modify as needed to accomplish the same outcome. There are pictures of the parts laid out from an original Snuff R Not out there, so it would be easy to replicate with some basic fab skills, if your a welder to boot. ;)

Even the slide in baffles could be fabricated if you wanted to take it to a higher level. I have some in my CL77 exhaust that I could take pictures and measurements of for a design on that option. Someone on here fabricated a baffle from some copper water pipe I believe for a larger muffler baffle insert. Was that you BB? :)
 
boddy said:
I think the idea was to set the washer at a certain angle of opening and then lock it in place. Of course drilling holes in the washer would work as well
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They were made in two different sizes, the smaller ones had three holes, the larger ones a single hole. To make your own: pick out a flat washer the right diameter to fit the pipe and short piece of 1/4" threaded rod (a long 1/4 inch bolt would work also). Use a hacksaw or a cutoff wheel to make a slit in the rod so it fits over the edge of the washer, run a 1/4X20 square nut on the rod down to the edge of the washer( the square corners are needed to keep it in the the open or shut position), tack weld the parts together. Slip the washer/rod into the exhaust pipe, add a 1/4" washer and a small coil spring, thread on a 1/4X20 wing nut. Drill a hole in the wing nut so you can pin it in place with a roll pin or a cotter pin.
 
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ancientdad said:
That's an interesting idea. I've been thinking about what I could add to my straight pipes to cut down a little on the loudness, I'm going to give something like that a try.
Click to expand...
That’s what I did on the XS650 in my avatar. We called them lollipops; I had never even heard of snuff-or-nots. It actually made it run better too, so I ended up never opening them. In hind sight, slip in baffle chambers would have been even better.
 
Here are the Honda baffles that were also supplied in the exhaust pipes prior to the muffler option on the later model bikes. I have added some dimensions for reference to the item for build purposes. Given the costs of anything aftermarket these days a decent fabricator could build these I would expect much cheaper than an OEM muffler and the silicone gaskets that are required.


P1090626.JPGP1090623.JPG
 
I let My last set go, with the scrambler I sold a few months ago. They do quiet things down, although not much for making horsepower.
 
I found a set of the original baffles on eBay, not really cheap, but not bad. Two days after I bought the baffles I received a reply from an ad I had posted on Craig's list looking for Snuff or Nots. The seller had an original set of S50's in the packaging and his asking price was within reason even with shipping, now they are on the way. I am a man with a lot of options currently, no money, but a lot of options.....
a. Muffler with packing
b. CL72/77 OEM baffles
c. Original set of Snuff or Nots.......

Looks like I may be looking for an extra set of pipes in the future. Damn sure going to be awhile though, I have to find a buyer for my extra kidney while collecting aluminum cans along the highway.....
 
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