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    AD

1971 CL450 that sat for 40 years.

Danager4792 said:
Unfortunately it looks as though DavidSilver discontinued them. They range on eBay from $49.99 to $112.99. Figured it would be worth a shot!
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Oops! Maybe I bought the last one for the K0, because the one I bought is gone now from DSS. And anyway, you need a different one for the 5 speed.
 
ancientdad said:
The alternator harness stay directly above that shorter section of chain is interesting, I wonder if your engine has one?
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I’ve been trying to look at alternator diagrams to find this harness stay with no luck. Where would it be located at?


ancientdad said:
Directly above the lever is the star part of the detent mechanism that goes on the end of the shift drum, and you should look at it to see how much wear the tips of the 'star' have. It might be the old one that was changed along with the pizza cutter, which could mean they changed both (and might tell you about the true condition of the pizza cutter too).
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Here is the condition of that piece. Looks pretty worn.
 
Danager4792 said:
I’ve been trying to look at alternator diagrams to find this harness stay with no luck. Where would it be located at?
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The very back of the engine, right in front of the vertical frame tube between the carbs.
Danager4792 said:
Here is the condition of that piece. Looks pretty worn.
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These points are the important wear areas, and yours looks to be bad enough to replace even though I can't get a clear view of them in that pic.

detent.jpg
 
ancientdad said:
The very back of the engine, right in front of the vertical frame tube between the carbs.

These points are the important wear areas, and yours looks to be bad enough to replace even though I can't get a clear view of them in that pic.

View attachment 31133
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That was the star piece located in the spare parts pile. Hopefully it was replaced and mine looks ok that’s in the bike, as we currently don’t have any knowledge I’m holding the original.
 
Another annoying find with this bike.
While installing the missing front brake switch, I discovered that the front brake lever is actually an upside down clutch lever. Also, as AD pointed out before, the brake cable adjuster is also too big. I have a new cable inside.


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With the brake switch installed, the switch has nothing to press against. So I’m assuming that’s why they tossed the switch in the first place.

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There was a spare lever in the parts box, but is too big to fit. Also, isn’t this a “power” lever?

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I’ll get on 4into1 and order a matching lever set, unless anyone has any particular recommendations. Thanks
 
Danager4792 said:
With the brake switch installed, the switch has nothing to press against.
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The brake light switch works when the lever is pulled, it makes internal contact when the lever releases the little black plastic nib to move outward. It doesn't need something to push it.
Danager4792 said:
Also, isn’t this a “power” lever?
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Yes
Danager4792 said:
I’ll get on 4into1 and order a matching lever set, unless anyone has any particular recommendations.
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That's where I buy my levers, but make sure they are original replacements from them so you'll know they fit the original perches built into the handlebar switch.
 
ancientdad said:
The brake light switch works when the lever is pulled, it makes internal contact when the lever releases the little black plastic nib to move outward. It doesn't need something to push it.
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Perhaps, but if there is no part of the lever to return the nib to its OFF postion when the lever is released, the brake light will be on all the time. That is the same as having no brake light at all, because the light doesn't get any brighter when the brakes are applied.
 
ancientdad said:
The brake light switch works when the lever is pulled, it makes internal contact when the lever releases the little black plastic nib to move outward. It doesn't need something to push it.
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Correct. I meant to say that the little black plastic nib has nothing pushing against it, meaning it’s always released.
 
Also, I am curious if it’s ok that the brake arm is bent. I’m assuming it was done purposely for the CL wheel and CB forks to work.

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I cringe at those wrong levers. Get the correct ones. Looks like maybe a kink in your front cable housing where it dives down behind the bucket, plus it's kinda dry, rusty, old. Kinks are high friction and almost never can be straightened. Once the plastic sheathing cracks, water gets in, rust, etc. Get a new one, you deserve it. At least oil the heck out of it, till you do. The adjusters, if not bent can be de-rusted and re-used or 4into1 has new ones. They should always be mostly threaded in, I leave no more than one locknut distance out and adjust at the bottom.
 
ballbearian said:
I cringe at those wrong levers. Get the correct ones. Looks like maybe a kink in your front cable housing where it dives down behind the bucket, plus it's kinda dry, rusty, old. Kinks are high friction and almost never can be straightened. Once the plastic sheathing cracks, water gets in, rust, etc. Get a new one, you deserve it. At least oil the heck out of it, till you do. The adjusters, if not bent can be de-rusted and re-used or 4into1 has new ones. They should always be mostly threaded in, I leave no more than one locknut distance out and adjust at the bottom.
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Thanks for the heads up. I actually have a brand new cable in the house. To be honest, I wasn’t very sure where to start with disconnecting the cable from the wheel.

The front drums are seized. No front brake right now.

Edit: It’s a possibility that the front brake drums do work, maybe the cable is really bad, and not setup correctly.

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While the front brake cable is loose at the top (lever out is perfect, out of the way) you can check how easily the cable moves. And with it disconnected, you should be able to push the front lever on the brake linkage at the backing plate. Push behind where the inner cable hooks to the front lever and see if the shafts for the brake cams feel dry/rusted/frozen or if both ends of the linkage work freely. To remove the cable, if it's disconnected at the top you can loosen the nuts on the lower threaded section of the cable, slide it forward in the boss on the backing plate and then slip the cable end out of the clevis. Then you pull it back and slip the inner cable through the slot in the boss.
 
Maybe the cable is seized. Does that chrome brake arm move? Personally, I like to undo the lever end first. Loosen that fat nut to the right to get max slack then pull the upper lever pivot bolt out and it's easier to get the cable completely out of the perch and the lever handle. Then try to move that lower arm to unhook the end of the cable from little pivoting yoke. Failing that, you can remove the pinch bolt and slide the arm off it's splined shaft.

By the looks of it, it needs the front wheel off and the brake plate removed and the two pivot shafts cleaned then greased. maybe new shoes then too. As long as you're at it, the speedo drive and hub bearings should at least be checked. Does it need a new tire? Lift the front end and spin the wheel, does it need trued for run out (side to side) or hop (up and down)?
Don't pull your hair out, it'll fall out on it's own eventually. :)
 
Thanks a lot gentlemen. Got it free. The cable was completely seized.. didn’t move at all. This is the first time I’ve been able to move the brake arm since having the bike.

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https://imgur.com/a/mxGwenq

Also, I couldn’t help myself but to put the CL350 fender on. (If anyone is wondering, I have CB forks with diagonal bolt holes, CL450 fender with horizontal bolt holes won’t work.)

I had to buy 1972 CB450 reflectors to fit in the fork ears. The ‘71 CL450 reflectors I bought were too small to screw in.
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It is off center, but I’m sure some careful “bending” could fix it.

Also, was curious what the bolt hole could have been used for on the lower steering stem seen right below the headlight. (The upper steering stem was identified to be from a CB750)
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The slow return of the brake linkage in the video says it needs to be taken apart and cleaned up. There should be completely free movement. Fender looks much better, give it a little flex to get it right. Also, there's no lock tab on the front brake torque arm at the backing plate, you need at least a lock washer there.
 
Honda liked to bolt horns up to that spot in the late 70’s/80’s. Possibly held that bracket.
 
Closest thing I could find was under a “CB750F Handlebar/Top bridge diagram. Clip for a wiring harness.
 
Do all front brake cables require an adjuster wheel/jam nut? My 4into1 cable did not come with one.
 
@ancientdad I was curious if you had any trouble getting your beam pattern centered on the headlight that we have. Mine is a little to the left.

I took the headlight in and out of the bracket about 4-5 times trying to get it as even as possible. The left “edge” of the headlight sticks out about 2% higher than the right. Those W spring clips can be a pain in the you know what.

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PITA? Yeah, they can be. I'll know more about how it's aimed when I take it out at night the first time, but it seems fairly centered in the garage. The glass on mine isn't perfectly centered but it isn't really noticeable. I have more parts to work with now so things will be evolving a little once the new-to-me gauge gets here. Even though your battery is 3 times the capacity of mine, don't idle with that 55w low beam on for too long or the battery will be going negative.
 
ancientdad said:
Even though your battery is 3 times the capacity of mine, don't idle with that 55w low beam on for too long or the battery will be going negative.
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Yeah, it’s wild seeing the battery tender at 100% then after a few moments it dips down to 50%.

I saved my bits & pieces from the original sealed beam headlignt & rim. If I had to remember how to put it all back together, I’d be in deep trouble.

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The spacer at upper right looks unfamiliar for that group, maybe one of the spacers in the plastic headlight case where the bolts go through the ears?
 
ancientdad said:
The spacer at upper right looks unfamiliar for that group, maybe one of the spacers in the plastic headlight case where the bolts go through the ears?
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Found it lodged in between the headlight and outer rim. According to the parts diagram you would be correct. I never knew spacers went there, mine never had any.
 
Danager4792 said:
Found it lodged in between the headlight and outer rim. According to the parts diagram you would be correct. I never knew spacers went there, mine never had any.
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The plastic cases had spacers inside the bolt hole so tightening the bolts to hold the headlight still in the ears wouldn't break the plastic. Someone must have pulled the bolt out and it fell inside. With all the wrong stuff on your bike it's not surprising at all. I swear, the shop that had your bike for all those years had to have cannibalized it along the way.
 
ancientdad said:
I swear, the shop that had your bike for all those years had to have cannibalized it along the way.
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It has been frustrating to say the least. When I complete this bike, I’ll have to compile a list of everything that was missing off of the bike and post it.

I have tried tracking down previous sellers and buyers of the bike to no avail. I bought it from a guy in Mason TN who only had it for a week. Due to his wife’s health, he decided to cancel the project. He bought it from Zac Green of Michigan Vintage Motorcycles. Both his Facebook page and the business page have been inactive for a year. Supposedly, Zac never even saw the bike. He had his delivery driver go purchase it, list it for sale online, and then it came to Mason TN. The delivery driver is the one who had the story that we are told to believe. I have tried calling Zac and have left a couple voicemails. If I could speak to the delivery driver that would be ideal. And to even get a phone number from the person they got it from. I have a hard time seeing the bikes condition in comparison to only 5k miles on the odometer.
 
Danager4792 said:
I have a hard time seeing the bikes condition in comparison to only 5k miles on the odometer.
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Absolutely. Few bikes get that disassembled and reassembled with different parts in that few miles, and with the wrong parts used in replacement seemingly for no obvious reason, all probably while sitting for what, 20 years at a shop. Yeah, something smells.
 
ancientdad said:
Absolutely. Few bikes get that disassembled and reassembled with different parts in that few miles, and with the wrong parts used in replacement seemingly for no obvious reason, all probably while sitting for what, 20 years at a shop. Yeah, something smells.
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There are a couple parts of the story that line up. The title is dated 1983(supposedly when the owner dropped the bike off and he passed away). The bikes keychain is also loaded with his house and truck keys. Sometimes I made a joke that he was haunting the bike and not wanting it to run right. Hopefully I don’t have any problems with TN’s registration process. I was planning to start that when the bike is close to being done.
 
Danager4792 said:
There are a couple parts of the story that line up. The title is dated 1983(supposedly when the owner dropped the bike off and he passed away). The bikes keychain is also loaded with his house and truck keys. Sometimes I made a joke that he was haunting the bike and not wanting it to run right. Hopefully I don’t have any problems with TN’s registration process. I was planning to start that when the bike is close to being done.
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Yeah, and those things make sense but the time at the shop is what smells IMO. I've worked at shops, even the Honda dealerships will do that kind of thing once they know they'll own the bike in the end. They just let the next person worry about it, and of course it's their right as the owner by way of storage fees and legalities. It's just a shame it wasn't still in the same condition as the old guy likely left it with them, doesn't seem like he would have dropped it off in 1983 like it was when you got it. Would have been a pretty sad bike he owned if it was like you got it when only barely 10 years old.
 
Very interesting news. I found the family through searching on whitepages.com, using the name on the title. I am chatting now with the granddaughter after finding her on FB. The owner "who dropped the bike off in 1983 and passed shortly after" died in 2020. I am possibly going to be able to speak with his wife/family to see what they remember about the bike.
 
ballbearian said:
I guess 37 years could be "shortly" if he was Methuzelah. Still, the backstory on these old bikes is always interesting. Inanimate objects witnessing of actual lives lived.
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Yeah we can throw out the story that I was told. Forget this bike ever being at a motorcycle shop. It was tossed between brothers, grandsons, and uncles to repair. When I get a semi-complete story, I'll post it.
 
Danager4792 said:
Yeah we can throw out the story that I was told. Forget this bike ever being at a motorcycle shop. It was tossed between brothers, grandsons, and uncles to repair. When I get a semi-complete story, I'll post it.
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Well, that changes everything.
 
When I bought my CB200 I tried getting in touch with the titled owners daughter but never got a response. I think we like to believe our bikes were cared for in the past the way we care for them. I only know a little bit about one bike I own, My CL450 and it’s not much.
 
My decision is that I won't spend much money on any project bike until I know that I own it. It's not easy sometimes, but here in California I can get a title without registering a bike for road use. I fill out lots of forms and then file for a title with planned non-operation status. Once I get a title at least I know that I own the bike.
 
I just got off of the phone with the owner's son, who made all of the repairs and maintained the bike. At first I was talking to the granddaugher, who made the claims that multiple family members had worked on the bike. The son clarified that she was referring to a 360 Benelli that was tossed around the family, and that he wouldn't dare touch it since it had been through so many hands.

This is going to be a difficult repair list to compile. Bear with me on the order of events and how they took place. This granted me a lot of closure and knowledge on the history of the bike.

According to the son:

-His father acquired the bike in 1977 from his Uncle who had it momentarily.
-The last known healthy running year for the bike was 1986. It rode many miles to Canada back and forth in its previous years. (They live in Michigan).
-The son, in a period of desperation, tried to get the bike to idle and putt around the backyard in 2020 for his Dad to sit on and enjoy right before his Dad passed.
-When the Uncle received the bike in 1976, it had the '72 and after fork setup on it.


Repairs/History:

Color/Cosmetics
-The bike was originally Candy Topaz Orange, as I noticed seeing under one of the side covers. The Uncle painted the bike sky blue and it was definitely not Strato Blue Metallic according to the son. This can be seen from chips under the fuel tank.
-The Dad did not like the color, so the son grabbed what was on the shelf in his garage. The color is a paint combo of Crimson Red, Brandy Wine, and a hint of black paint.
-He has no idea why the engine crankcase covers are black. They weren't that color when he sold it a few years ago.
-The front and rear fender both had a crack on them near the ends, so they chopped off 2in of the fenders on both the front and rear.

Front of bike
-The CB front fender came on the bike when his Uncle got it.
-He warned me that I'm missing the gauge brackets under the gauges, and thats why they are so far apart.
-One of his family members tipped over the bike and cracked the triple tree, so his friend offered to replace it with one from a CB750.
-The front headlight bucket is from a 73-74 CB350.
-The bucket was missing the high beam indicator and there was a hole, so he covered it up with fiberglass.
-I didnt really get this, but he said the front fork ears are made from two sets of CB350 fork ears, so they end up being 2in longer than original. They will most likely fall apart when I take them off.
-Steering bearings are original, he regreased them.
-Odometer and tach gauges were replaced because of damage. They suspected the front end was previously in a wreck when the Uncle received the bike.
-The right throttle side controls are from a CB350

Wheels
-They have never been touched or opened up. Bearings and drum brakes will need attention.

Exhaust/Muffler
-The baffle(s) broke loose, so they cut open the mufflers and tried to secure the baffles with the three screws in the top, then welded it back together.

Tires
-The back tire came off of a Harley Sportster

Chain
-An o-ring chain was put on the bike since a nephew of his was going to use the bike for off-roading, but then changed his mind.

Clutch/Transmission
-The son couldn't figure out for his life why the transmission was acting up, spent weeks on it, so they pulled a transmission from another CL450 motor and it fixed everything.
-He installed new transmission bearings.
-He Installed new clutch plates
-Even though he read the FSM a lot, he couldn't understand the clutch cable setup. He did it the "Harley way" and it rode fine.
His definition - Unscrew the cable adjuster nut all the way. Go to the clutch lever adjustment. Turn it left and then barely turn it right until it touches. Tighten cable nut.

Rear brake light
-When they received the bike from the Uncle, the bike didn't have rear turn signals, so the father drilled holes in the rear bracket to mount turn signals through there.

Engine
-He says he came home one day, and for whatever unknown reason, the engine was completely disassembled and in pieces in the garage. He never got a straight answer of why his father did this.
-His father momentarily had a different CL450 engine in the bike while the other one was in pieces.
-The son said that he got fed up and wanted to rebuild the original engine. He installed new OEM pistons and rings to OEM spec.
-The original engine went back into the bike.


He then asked me about the wiring and if I noticed anything, while laughing. He apologized for the hacked wiring. He couldn’t acquire a glass fuse so he rigged up a blade fuse. He also apologized for the cracked cam bearing on the points side. He grabbed one from his spare parts bin. He said the bike hadn't ran in 20+ years and he at least wanted it to idle so he could see his Dad sit on it one last time before he passed. That's also why there is an upside down clutch lever for the brake lever. He said he had to make things do for the time he had.

He says somewhere there is a basket of parts he would like to send to me that came off of the bike. And he is very excited to see the bike's progression for his father's memory.

Oh and here's the killer part. He could never get the bike to idle correctly and that's why he sold it. He said he cussed for months and years. I asked him if he knew he had two different carbs on there with two different fuel mixture screws(14H & 723A). He was dumbfounded and said that explains everything.

I cranked the bike up over the phone and he was speechless, said he never dreamed of it sounding that good.

He was generally mad at the story I was told. Explaining that it was just someone trying to sell me something, or the story got twisted. He was flabbergasted that his previous Michigan bike made it all the way down to Memphis TN. Sounds like I’ll need to edit my #1 post on this thread
 
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ballbearian said:
Priceless. :ROFLMAO:

At least you have a very "interesting" bike.
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Forgot to add that there was another time, shortly after the engine was out, that he came home and everything was stripped down to the frame except for the two wheels still on the bike.
 
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